From near bankruptcy to financial freedom. Here’s the alternative way to a financially secure retirement you hadn’t thought of…
Imagine retiring with $10K–$20K monthly income—or even achieving $100K months.
That’s what Lucy and Gary accomplished after re-skilling in digital business, despite nearly facing bankruptcy during the GFC.
In this interview, you’ll hear their inspiring story, including:
- How they turned $200 websites into $100K months
- The exact strategies they used to grow a sustainable online business
- Why re-skilling is the key to financial freedom, no matter your age
- And much much more.
Ready to discover how to create a thriving income stream in retirement? Keep reading or watch the interview below to learn their secrets.
Matt Raad: Welcome to today’s episode of the Digital Investor podcast! We have a very special guest and an important topic to explore: retirement, with a focus on achieving financial independence or financial freedom in retirement. We’ll also discuss how re-skilling in digital skills can help you reach these goals.
Joining us is the perfect person to talk about this topic—one of our coaches here at the eBusiness Institute, and one of our most successful students. Lucy, thank you for joining us today!
Lucy: Thank you, Matt. It is wonderful to be here, and it’s lovely to chat with you again.
If you’re nearing retirement, or looking to achieve early retirement, it’s time to find a way to secure your financial future
Matt: This is such an important topic. As you know, you, Liz, and I are incredibly passionate about this subject.
We see so many people heading into retirement, looking for financial independence and freedom. It’s a path you’ve personally walked, Lucy, and one you’re passionate about because you’ve achieved financial independence yourself.
For our readers, especially those in their 50s, this article is for you. If you’re planning to retire in the next 10 to 15 years, now is the time to start preparing. At eBusiness Institute, our focus is on future-proofing your life and income.
We are all about buying and selling online businesses, renovating them, and creating income streams in the online world. The beauty of this is the flexibility—it allows you to work from anywhere, at any time, and at any age.
If you’re new to this, we understand you may feel worried and have a lot of fear around this. You might think, “I don’t have the knowledge.” That’s exactly why we want you to read Lucy’s story.
The turning point of Lucy’s journey began 10 years ago
When their backs were against the wall, see how Lucy and Gary turned their financial story around…
Matt: So, let’s dive in, Lucy. Once upon a time, you were in the same shoes as our readers. How long ago did you start with us? You’ve achieved incredible success online—let’s start there.
Lucy: Well, in 2014, we were still feeling the effects of the GFC. At the time, we owned an importing and manufacturing company, but it was really struggling. We could see the writing on the wall. This was a multimillion-dollar business, and we had envisioned it providing a nice, comfortable retirement for us.
But the GFC hit us hard—so hard that when we first met you, I was desperate to try something new. At the time, I was very passionate about a particular lifestyle around food, and in one of those entrepreneurial moments, I thought, “Let’s open a café.” I had no hospitality experience, but we went for it.
So, there we were: a failing importing and manufacturing business on one side, and a brand-new café on the other—an industry I knew nothing about. We were caught in this limbo of “What are we doing? What’s next?”
We’re what you’d call the “sandwich generation.” We were supporting kids at university, and also helping our parents with housing.
We got to the point where we weren’t drawing an income—our priority was paying our staff. That’s all we could manage.
They sought expert help at the right time to avoid bankruptcy…
Lucy: When we met Matt and Liz Raad, we knew we had to make a change. I wouldn’t say we were panicked, but we were incredibly concerned. Things were so serious we were researching what bankruptcy might mean for us.
Then we found you. And thank goodness—it was a turning point!
Matt: What are the chances that you’d meet us, Lucy? As it happens, Liz and I specialise in import, wholesale, and manufacturing businesses.
One of the key ways we helped Lucy and Gary in the early days was by crafting an effective strategy to exit their significant business without going through bankruptcy.
We’ve been down this road many times with clients, and I’m happy to say it worked out very nicely, didn’t it, Lucy?
Lucy: It absolutely did.
Matt: To this day, I think it’s wonderful that the four of us can still come together and celebrate. That alone—the successful exit from your old business—was life-changing.
…And took their first steps to create an online business
Matt: What’s even more important is what came next because it was a life changing moment for you. You and Gary didn’t just close the chapter on an old-fashioned business—you embraced the new online space and truly excelled.
Listening to you now, I have to admit something. At the time, I didn’t fully grasp just how close to panic you and Gary were. From my perspective, I was just calmly helping you through the process—“Do this, do that.” And credit to you both, you followed everything we suggested, particularly when it came to online businesses. I didn’t realise until later that one of your biggest motivations was that you were nearly at breaking point.
But what’s incredible is how well the online space worked for you. It went exceptionally well. For anyone reading this, just wait until you hear the results—it’s truly remarkable.
They had no online experience, but had the commitment to make it work
Lucy: For Gary and I, the key at that time was our total commitment. I still remember sitting in a conference where Matt and Liz Raad were speaking about buying and selling websites. During the break, I went outside, called Gary, and said, “You’ve got to meet these guys—you’re going to love this!”
Gary’s background is in accountancy; he was the financial controller for our company and very numbers-driven. Meanwhile, I handled emails and online banking, but that was the extent of our online knowledge. We really had no digital experience. My son-in-law had built a basic website for my café, but it was extremely basic.
What struck me during that conference was what you were saying—your background and experience. I thought, “They did it. They transitioned. We’re not stupid. We can learn this, too”. I didn’t even fully understand what “this” was at the time, but I knew we had to try something new.
Lucy realised it was possible to start an online business without massive startup costs
Lucy: What really caught my attention was when you and Liz explained that it didn’t require massive startup costs.
Coming from importing and manufacturing, where we had so much money tied up in stock, staff, reps, and cars, the idea of starting another business felt overwhelming. But then you said, “Hey, there’s an easier way,” and that immediately resonated with me.
Matt: Startup costs can be a huge barrier for many people.
Lucy & Gary’s strategy was to buy and sell websites for income
Matt: So, Lucy, when you first started with us, what was the initial strategy you decided to pursue? What did you do?
Lucy: Well, we had to jump in the deep end. I hope it’s okay to say this, but we decided to use some of Gary’s superannuation. We just thought “We’re going all in”.
At the time, you were teaching us how to buy and renovate websites—where to find them and how to approach the process. What really stood out to us was how beautifully simple and structured your teaching was. It was step-by-step, which made it easy for us to follow.
By sticking to your system, we learned how to renovate websites to either start generating income or increase what they were already earning.
They took a strategic approach to minimise their risk
Lucy: We probably went in a bit more aggressively than others might because we needed results quickly. So, we focused on buying websites that were already making money and then renovating them to improve their performance.
Matt: Here’s where I want to step in, Lucy, because there’s an important point you’ve touched on. You mentioned going in a bit aggressively, but for anyone reading this, I want to be very clear—there was one significant factor at play.
I made sure Lucy and Gary didn’t go too aggressive. At the time, I didn’t know all the details of what was happening in the background for them, but I was very conscious of not letting them overextend themselves.
So, if you’re reading this, note that while Lucy and Gary made bold moves, we like to keep things measured and strategic to minimise risk.
Lucy: You won’t let me get away with that one!
Matt: This is so exciting to reflect on, Lucy. It’s literally 10 years later—it’s 2024 now—and we’re sitting here recording this. Back then, I didn’t know everything that was happening in the background for you and Gary.
How starting with small website investments lead Lucy & Gary to financial security
Matt: If you’ve been following our podcasts, you’ll know that we always emphasise this: Learn first. Start small and stay safe. So when you talk about going in aggressively, I want to clarify for our readers—this wasn’t a “get rich quick” situation. It wasn’t like Lucy and Gary suddenly got a free pass out of their challenges.
How long did it take, Lucy? What steps did you take? And poor old Gary—this explains why he was a little upset with me for quite some time! He was the one crunching the numbers and probably felt the pressure more than anyone.
Let’s talk about that. Who kept things steady? Who really drove it forward?
Lucy: Gary was all in—he wanted to go for it; we both did. We were ready to go in hard, buying big websites that were already making money because we could see the potential. We also trusted you guys completely. By then, we’d figured out that you were the real deal—decent, trustworthy people.
Starting small allowed them to make mistakes and learn safely without risking a lot of capital
Lucy: You kept saying, “No, don’t go in hard.” And honestly, it was such wise advice. If we’d bought big websites back then, we could have blown everything. Instead, you kept urging us to slow down. “Take your time. Don’t go in guns blazing. Start small.”
So, we did. We started with a few small purchases—literally $200 websites. And thank goodness we did because we broke them! We made all our mistakes on those smaller websites while learning.
And learning means making mistakes, right? If we’d done that with $20,000 or $50,000 websites, it would have destroyed us. But starting small gave us the freedom to make those mistakes safely.
Matt: Take note—what Lucy and Gary did. In hindsight, it was incredibly smart. Their story shows the reality: they couldn’t afford another business mistake. That’s exactly what Liz, I, and all of us here at the eBusiness Institute are about—minimising risk while setting you up for success.
When you’re nearing retirement, it’s NOT the time to be taking massive risks
Matt: Now, especially with the way the economy and financial systems are today, this is not the time to take massive, foolish financial risks. For those of you approaching retirement, it’s a particularly dangerous time in life to be taking on big debts or doing things with your money that you don’t fully understand.
I’m being your mentor, not your mother, here. So, I’ll be super blunt, just as I was with Lucy and Gary back then: learn first, and don’t risk a lot to start with.
Lucy, would you say that approach gave you the ability to get through that critical first year without overextending yourselves? It took you about a year to gain all the knowledge you needed.
Lucy: Absolutely!
From complete beginners online to earning $100,000 a month in their second year learning
Matt: Can you share what happened next? Because at the end of that first year with us, you joined us with Champions again, which was fantastic!
Lucy: Gary and I approached this almost like a university degree. We weren’t going to miss “the second year.”
1./ They treated their ongoing learning as a university degree
Lucy: We just jumped straight in, knowing that while the core content of your course stayed the same, you had your finger on the pulse and constantly updated it to reflect new trends. That meant every year brought new learning opportunities, and we wanted to stay on top.
2./ They built proof for themselves by earning their first $1,000 month
We behaved ourselves in that first year—sticking to the plan and learning the ropes. By around month 11, I think we had our first $1,000 month in income. That was such an exciting milestone for us!
Back then—10 years ago—there was still a lot of scepticism around online businesses. People would say, “Oh, it’s just a get-rich-quick scheme” or “It’s not real.” So hitting that $1,000 mark felt like proof to us. We thought, “If we can make $1,000, we can make $10,000. And if we can make $10,000, maybe we can make $100,000.”
3./ They consistently applied action and earned $100,000 per month within 18 months
And you know what? We hit that $100,000 goal around month 18. That was incredibly exciting!
Matt: This is impressive, Lucy. I often take these things for granted, but for our readers, it’s important to clarify. When Lucy mentions these numbers, they are net earnings calculated per month. So, you’re saying you reached your first $1,000 month early, and then within 18 months, you hit $100,000.
Lucy & Gary became comfortable with their new digital skills, which helped to build their momentum
Lucy: Yes. And after that first milestone, things really started to snowball for us. Our digital skills increased, and the opportunities we saw completely shifted. It’s a bit like the difference between being a first-year medical student and someone who’s been practising for five years—you begin to see things with a much broader perspective.
By our second year, I remember sitting in your Annual Digital Investors Summit, thinking, “Oh my God, I actually understand this stuff now”. It was such a turning point.
The way those skills built over time and the way you structured the learning was so helpful, especially for us. We had no prior background in this. We didn’t even really know what a domain name was! That’s how basic our skills were. We understood what a website was, but beyond that, we were starting from scratch.
But as we followed the process, it all began to make sense. The foundation you provided gave us the confidence to keep building on our knowledge.
They now have the foundation to earn income much easier than traditional bricks-and-mortar businesses
Matt: It’s absolutely mind-blowing, Lucy—here we are, 10 years later, recording this. Isn’t it funny how the universe works? We decided to do this podcast not to mark a 10-year reunion update. It’s because Lucy, like us, is deeply concerned about fellow retirees—not just friends—facing financial uncertainty and lacking the skills to build independence.
But let’s take a moment to pinch ourselves. Over these 10 years, Lucy, you’ve gone from almost bankruptcy to heading into retirement with $10,000 months, $20,000 months at Christmas, and even $100,000 months. That’s serious financial success—completely pension-free.
From running a café—which, let’s face it, is grueling, 5 AM to 9 PM work—to this lifestyle where you work from home on a beautiful acreage in the hinterlands, it’s simply incredible. Congratulations to you and Gary!
Today, they buy and operate much bigger websites, because they have learned the skills to do so…
Matt: Lucy, you and Gary followed the system. You started small, buying inexpensive websites in the beginning, and gradually stepped it up in your second year.
You moved from $3,000 websites to $5,000 ones, and then to $20,000 websites. I think that $20,000 purchase was a real turning point for you. Would you agree?
Lucy: We bought one site for $20,000 and then another for $50,000. Then we knew what we were doing and still got your advice.
Matt: I remember helping you with those, and it was a bit of a scary moment for me to let you move forward because I realised how crucial funds were. You had to be very careful with your money. I just had this feeling that you needed to tread carefully. I wondered, “Should I let them buy this $50,000 website?”
Lucy still has the same techie from 10 years ago!
Matt: Credit to you both, and here’s something even more impressive—you’re still working with the same techie from those days, aren’t you?
Lucy: Yes, absolutely!
Matt: And that’s pretty much your team to this day, right?
Lucy: Yes, I hire people through platforms like Upwork as needed, and over time, I’ve built a great team of regulars for different tasks. I even have one full-time techie based in the Philippines—a fantastic young guy who’s been with us for years.
I’ve had the privilege of seeing him through his marriage and the birth of his children. He’s now a full-time stay-at-home dad, which is amazing. He works remotely, and we have a great system: we put up jobs, he takes care of them, and he truly understands our needs.
He knows both mine and Gary’s weaknesses and compensates for them perfectly. He understands what we expect and delivers every time. It’s such a beautiful working arrangement, and it’s been a big part of our success.
Helping older people overcome the FEAR of retraining in digital skills
Even if you’re nearing retirement, there is a lot of value in reskilling later in life…
Matt: I’m sitting here, amazed by your retirement, which stands in such contrast. Naturally, the best part of your retirement is working with us?
Lucy: Oh yes, absolutely!
Matt: It doesn’t get any better, does it? Working with our clients is very satisfying, don’t you think?
Lucy: Coaching is something I truly love. I meet such wonderful people—young individuals, people my age, and those in between. Everyone comes with their own expectations, different interests and skills, and I enjoy getting to know them and helping students move toward their online goals.
Even if someone doesn’t want to follow the exact path Gary and I took, I love guiding them to create a future they can see and work toward.
I’d be lying if I said it wasn’t hard work at times for Gary and I. There were long days, and it’s still a business after all. But knowing where we were headed made it all worthwhile, and we could see the future. I love being able to work with people to help them see that for themselves, too.
When you work online, age is irrelevant – it’s about having the right approach…
Lucy: This is one of the reasons this work is so meaningful to me. We live in an area that’s essentially one big retirement village, with many self-funded retirees. But the reality is, it’s not always the luxurious lifestyle people imagine.
When we talk with retirees, as you mentioned earlier, there’s often fear—fear of the future and of running out of money. And when we share what we do, the response is often, “Oh, I couldn’t do that. It’s not my skill set. I wouldn’t understand it”.
That’s when I remind them, “This was our background too”. Gary and I had no online skills when we started, but we learned step by step. It’s proof that anyone can start small and grow into something great.
Then we explain to them that it is something, particularly an oldie that you can do. It’s not just the young kids that have these skills. Gary and I could talk most young techies under the table with what we know now, but we knew nothing when we began.
Matt: If you’re reading this, you’ve heard Lucy mention the hard work involved in the early days. Let’s be clear—this isn’t about magically rolling into a semi-passive retirement and suddenly earning $100,000 months. It depends on your goals.
So, take this as a wake-up call. In our community, we see a lot of semi-retirees, early retirees, and people in their 50s and beyond who are in a similar position to where Lucy and Gary were 10 years ago—supporting young kids, helping their parents, and trying to plan for their own future.
You need to start planning now. Lucy and Gary’s story shows that there is a way forward, and it’s achievable. Their outcome is proof of what’s possible with the right approach.
Lucy and Gary have achieved a lifestyle of balance and freedom
Matt: So Lucy, you and Gary are fully retired now, right? I’m presuming you don’t work nearly as hard as you did in those early days. Has Gary completely stepped back?
Lucy: Oh, I’ll still grab Gary now and then and say, “Can you take a look at this? Do some SEO for me.” He’ll dust off his laptop, literally, and dive in. He still loves it. That data-driven part of his brain just lights up with SEO. I don’t think I could ever stop him talking about it!
But we live on a 40 acre property. So, most of the time, he’s playing outside, wielding his chainsaw (which scares the life out of me), or riding around on his mower. He’s really embraced this lovely, relaxed lifestyle, which is such a far cry from where we were headed 10 years ago.
As an early retiree, Lucy only works 10-20 hours per week
Lucy: As for me, I’ve kept a few websites and clients in different areas that I love working with. I also do some coaching for eBusiness Institute, which I really enjoy. On average, I probably do about 10 hours a week, sometimes up to 20, depending on what’s happening.
But this is real life—I’m a bit younger than Gary, so I’ll keep going for a while longer. It’s a great balance, and I love the flexibility it gives me.
Honestly, Matt, it doesn’t feel like work. Retirement has a completely different meaning for me now. I was telling you earlier about some friends I recently caught up with. They’re a bit older than us, in their mid-seventies, and they’re only now considering retiring at the end of the year.
They’re exhausted, completely burnt out, and just can’t wait to stop working. During our chat, one of them asked me, “So when are you going to retire?” I had to laugh because Gary pretty much already has. But I said, “Actually, I don’t feel like I work”.
It’s not just about stopping work—it’s about enjoying what you do in life…
Lucy: I could do this forever. I don’t want to be that old lady sitting there doing crosswords. I want to be that old lady sitting there building websites and having fun, getting them ranked and all that stuff. So, it’s a very different definition, but I wish everyone who lives in our area could do the same thing.
Why it’s important to plan ahead for retirement and not just rely on Government support
Matt: You have a lot of friends now who are retirees who live in your community. What are you saying to them?
I was surprised when you mentioned to me earlier how you are finding a lot of your friends want to avoid being on a pension or even do the grey nomad thing. They don’t want to downsize and sell up, they want to live well. Obviously, these are people who were high-income earners at some point and are now focused on keeping their financial independence. Can you talk about that?
Also, share that surprising rule we have here in rural Australia. For those reading in the U.S., this might really catch people off guard.
Lucy: So, we live in a farming community where most of us are on large acreages. In Queensland—and I’m not sure if this is the case Australia-wide—you can’t actually get the government pension if you live on more than five acres. I never knew that!
On our street, everyone has acreage. We’ve got one of the smaller blocks at 40 acres, and some of the neighbours are on land that’s either been in the family for generations or that they bought when they were younger to enjoy the space and a rural lifestyle.
Now, many of them are retired teachers or farmers, but they’re not primary producers—they just love living on the land. Unfortunately, they’ve found that because of this rule, they can’t qualify for the pension unless they sell. One neighbour even had to subdivide their property and reduce it to just five acres, which feels completely ridiculous. I don’t understand the rule, but it is what it is.
“I’m just incredibly grateful that we’ll never need to rely on the government pension because of what we’ve built for ourselves.” – Lucy
Matt: It’s definitely something to think about. No matter where you live, check the laws in your state when planning for retirement, especially if you’re looking to live on acreage. That said, you shouldn’t be thinking about relying on a pension anyway. I’d like to think that everyone in this space earns enough to be self-funded, without needing government support.
When it comes to the conversations you’re having with your friends, what do you say to them about re-skilling?
For people like you and me, it’s clear what retirees should be doing—that’s exactly why I wanted to record this podcast. My advice? Back up 10 years from your retirement date and start preparing and training for it now.
Age is irrelevant when you work online
Matt: What are you saying to the people in your community? What are the discussions you’re having with retirees? We work with many clients in this space, but you’re speaking with people who don’t even know this world exists. What’s it like when you explain what you do to them?
Lucy: Yes, we might head into town, take the dogs to the dog park after doing some shopping, and end up chatting with people. If we don’t know them, the conversation often drifts to what we do. We’ll say something like, “We buy and renovate online businesses, websites,,” and that usually gets a “What’s that?”
So, we elaborate a bit, and then you can see it—the moment their faces change, and they think, “I could never do that.” But the truth is, they absolutely can. Most people don’t realise how straightforward it is once you learn the basics.
I was telling you how younger people, quite often, can be a bit patronising with us older folks. It’s like, “Oh, good for you, keeping up with technology!” And I’ll admit, sometimes I can’t resist getting a bit cheeky. I might lay it on thick about what I know, just to make the point that age doesn’t limit what you can learn or achieve.
Matt: It must feel pretty good hearing young people make comments like that. You’re probably sitting there thinking, “You know what? I make more money than you do, all from home. I earn more in a month than you do in a year, working with just one staff member. No stress, and only putting in 10 hours a week.”
Lucy: That’s exactly it.
How Lucy and Gary proved age is no barrier to learning new skills
Matt: It’s something we’ve noticed in our community as well. I’ve had clients mention it to me—that once you reach a certain age, it becomes really hard to find jobs again, especially senior roles. People often get passed over. And then there’s this assumption that older people can’t learn how to reskill in digital. But you and Gary are proof that’s not the case.
Lucy: Gosh, Gary was almost at retirement age when we first met you. That’s what’s so interesting—this isn’t about younger people juggling full-time jobs and raising kids, trying to squeeze learning in late at night.
When I speak to some of your clients, they tell me they don’t even open their laptop until 9 PM because of their busy lives. But my friends? They’ve got time. They wake up, have their morning coffee, go for a walk, and then they have the whole day ahead of them. They could easily dedicate time to learning these skills.
Honestly, I wish I could give people a glimpse into how simple this process is when you follow your step-by-step system. And I don’t mean to sound like I’m plugging your course—but I am! It’s given us so much in our lives, and it’s genuinely not hard.
The key is being willing to re-skill and letting go of that mental block that says, “I can’t learn”. Of course, you can! We’re all capable of learning new things at any age. You just have to be open to the possibility.
Minimising your risk by learning from someone who’s done it before…
Matt: And so, Lucy, just tell them to do our free masterclass. If you’re reading this and haven’t done our free masterclass, go and do it. You’ll see Lucy and Gary on there.
You’ll see the kinds of sites Lucy and Gary buy now, and you’ll see how straightforward it is—well, “easy” in inverted commas—especially compared to running a bricks-and-mortar business. But I really want to drive home a key takeaway for anyone reading this: you can get into this at any stage of life, whether you’re older or younger, without taking massive financial risks.
If you’re smart about it, you don’t need to rush out and make huge investments. Lucy and Gary wanted to spend six figures on their first websites, but I didn’t let them—and if you’re reading this, I’m not letting you, either, until you’ve got the knowledge under your belt.
Because really, as Liz and I have seen over the years—and Lucy, I’m sure you’d agree now that you’re coaching our clients—the biggest risk isn’t financial; it’s knowledge. You just need to learn from someone who knows the process. It doesn’t have to be us, but you need to learn from someone.
…And minimise the fear by learning the right skills
Matt: Another crucial point, Lucy, that you and I are both passionate about is helping people get over their fear. Everyone has fears—we certainly did! It’s no secret that Liz and I put this off. Would you believe we saw the opportunity two years before we started but didn’t take the leap?
We had the same fears many people have: we’re from the country, we didn’t know how to code websites, and back then, coding was often required. It was intimidating.
Even now, I still get nervous about hitting the “update” or “publish” button, because, yes, things can go wrong. I’ve broken websites before—it’s scary! But the truth is, you learn as you go, and the fear gets easier to manage. So, know that the fear is normal, but it shouldn’t hold you back.
You’ve got to get over the fear—that’s what being an entrepreneur is all about. And I understand, as you get into your 60s, there can be this identity struggle where you think, Oh, I couldn’t possibly be an entrepreneur. Well, let me tell you, that’s total BS.
How many billionaires are 60-plus? A lot! In fact, many people make their fortunes later in life. If you’ve got even the smallest entrepreneurial spark, I hope this podcast has shown you that if you’re in that 50-plus age group, it’s absolutely worth investing in the knowledge and skills to move forward.
It’s time to start thinking about your financial freedom and retirement
Matt: Lucy, I want to say a massive thank you for joining us today and giving such valuable insights into what happened 10 years ago when you first started. It’s so inspirational for our community to hear from you.
Over the past decade, you and Gary have changed countless lives in our community. You’ve stood on our stages at live events, shared your journey at our bootcamps, and inspired so many with your story. And now, as a coach, you’re helping even more of our clients, who truly look up to you as proof that this works.
And hopefully, you’re telling them what I always say: Follow what Matt and Liz teach. It works. Start small, and take it step by step. That’s the real key to success. Build up big and have fun with it.
Thank you so much for coming along today, Lucy.
Lucy: My absolute pleasure, Matt. Thank you.
